supply the teachers required in the denominational schools connected with those colleges, if the Amendment were accepted. He hoped, therefore, it would not be pressed; if it were, he should certainly vote against it.

*EARL SPENCER: At Harrow there were many Siamese; I do not think they were ordered to attend chapel.

THE MARQUESS OF LONDONDERRY: But perhaps they had services or prayers in their own house. I maintain that if the Amendment were accepted, it would upset all the necessary arrangements for the management of these schools or colleges, and restrict very largely the number of institutions which could receive aid at the present nominational character. It is, therefore, moment without sacrificing their de

LORD BURGHCLERE pointed out that the argument of the Bishop of Newcastle hardly met the case. The right rev. Prelate had admitted the existence of a great deficiency of teachers, and expressed the hope that more colleges would be opened. But why, because there were so few teachers at the present moment, should they cut off, by insisting on the provision of the Bill, that supply impossible for the Government to agree of teachers which would be produced by to this proposal.

the Amendment? He could see absolutely

no harm in the proposal. Both at Oxford

LORD BURGHCLERE said it had and Cambridge, and also at Harrow, been held to be highly reprehensible in students of all denominations including the interests of religion to turn attendHindus, Parsees, and so forth-were ance at chapel or prayers into a mere afforded education, without being required to attend the religious services. Under calling over, and he believed it was now the circumstances he thought it only the general practice at both Oxford and reasonable that the Amendment should Cambridge, and in the public schools, not be accepted.

It was

THE MARQUESS OF LONDONDERRY: I do not for a moment deny the importance of the Amendment. discussed at considerable length in the other House, and the conclusion then arrived at was that considerable difference existed between residential colleges and hostels in which there were day scholars. I agree with the right rev. Prelate that it is absolutely necessary, in order to maintain, not only the spirit of the religious instruction, but also discipline, that this Amendment should not be inserted. No pressure whatever is put upon those who attend these colleges and live outside; but I think your Lordships will allow that, in whatever house or college you may have been, there was a religious service daily carried on, which not only maintained the religious atmosphere, but also discipline.

to call upon persons of other denominations to attend the various services or chapels.

EARL BEAUCHAMP expressed his thanks for the words of the Bishop of Southwell which would, he believed, be read in many Nonconformist circles with deep sympathy and interest. This matter was undoubtedly felt to be a substantial grievance by all the Nonconformists in the country, and he hoped their Lordships would do something to remedy that grievance. remedy that grievance.

On Question, "Whether the words proposed to be left out shall stand part of the Clause," their Lordships divided:Contents, 121; Not-Contents, 19.

THE MARQUESS OF LONDONDERRY: Why should they?

*THE LORD BISHOP OF HEREFORD to enable members of different denominapointed out that unless the Amendment tions to go to boarding schools and to were accepted, the localrauthority would enjoy such exemptions as were enjoyed have nothing whatever to say to the by day scholars. His proposal touched dismissal of the teachers. somewhat closely on the subject discussed earlier in the debate, but he believed it met the difficulty in a better way. In country districts there would be a certain number of boarding schools, suited to the needs of those districts, but tional character it became a great hardif all these schools were of a denomination living in ship to persons of a different denominathose districts that

*THE LORD BISHHOP OF HEREFORD contended that the local authority ought to have something to say in the matter, because it was in a school aided or sup ported by themselves. Under the Bill, as it stood, a sub-committee, or body of managers, or some local clique might dismiss a master and spoil the whole of his professional prospects, and yet there would be no person to whom that master could appeal against their decision. All he asked was that an appeal should be allowed to the local authority and the

Board of Education.

THE LORD BISHOP OF ELY asked whether it was not becoming the almost universal custom in important secondary schools for the Governors to appoint the head master and to look to him for the success of the school, putting entirely into his hands the question of the assistants. This Amendment would go exactly contrary to that almost universal practice.

*THE LORD BISHOP OF HEREFORD could not quite agree with the statement of his right reverend brother, but if it was the almost universal custom he felt, from his long experience, that it was a bad one for the profession. If they wished to encourage the profession, and to induce a high type of men to enter it, it was necessary that they should take care that individuals were not subjected to such arbitrary action without any right of appeal whatsoever.

On Question, Amendment negatived.

they should not be able to send their sons to those schools. That difficulty would be entirely met if the local authority required the children of Nonconformists to be admitted to the local Church boarding school under some such Clause as he now proposed. Moreover, it would entirely solve the difficulty with regard to training colleges, because hostels could be established to meet the requirements of Nonconformists. With regard to secondary schools, it had to be borne in mind that there might be no other suitable school within reach, and yet these parents would have to send their children to some boarding school, so that, unless some such Amendment were inserted, this hardship would press very heavily upon many parents. There ought certainly to be some guarantee that the children of parents of a denomination other than that to which the local school belonged-but a school, be it remembered, aided by local authority-should be admitted to that school without doing violence to their consciences. It was only reasonable that the training colleges, which were so largely supported by public money, should be willing to establish hostels and to make such boarding arrangements as would be suitable for the needs of such students.

the

*THE LORD BISHOP OF WINCHESTER: What do you mean by "boarding arrangements?"

*THE LORD BISHOP OF HEREFORD moved an Amendment providing that in every aided school or college at which boarders were received the local education authority should require suitable boarding arrangements to be made for the reception said the "boarding arrangements" in a of boarders whose parents belonged to

*THE LORD BISHOP OF HEREFORD

different religious denominations. He training college would mean the hostel. said the object of this Amendment was arrangements.

Amendment moved

"In Clause 4, page 2, line 38, to insert in every aided school or college at which boarders are received the local education authority shall require that suitable boarding arrangements are made for the reception of boarders whose parents belong to different religious denominations."-(The Lord Bishop of Hereford.)

THE LORD BISHOP OF WINCHESTER asked the right rev. Prelate to explain his argument by a concrete case. For in stance, should a Roman Catholic college be compelled at its own cost to provide a hostel or other accommodation outside for Wesleyan or Church of England

students?

of!

did the right rev. Prelate suggest that a Wesleyan school, under such circumstances, should be compelled to build a hostel for Church boys who might wish to attend the school? Reference had been made to the provision of a hostel for twenty-four boys at Clifton College; but many of these secondary schools would not have more than twenty-four boarders altogether, and was it intended that they should build a hostel for one boy?

*THE LORD BISHOP OF HEREFORD said that his Amendmentasked for suitable boarding arrangements to be made. At Rugby he had a single Roman Catholic pupil, for whom he made suitable boarding arrangements. Those "suitable boarding arrangements "consisted in allowing the boy to live in a Roman Catholic or other family agreeable to his parents, and that was what he meant by making "suitable boarding arrangements, SO as to put a boy in the same position as a day scholar.

LORD BURGHCLERE had considerable sympathy with the principles underlying the Amendment, but he thought the House had debated the real principle on a previous Amendment. There might also be some difficulties in the matter on the score of additional expense. Therefore, while he warmly supported the Amendment of Lord Beauchamp, he ventured to ask the right rev. Prelate to withdraw his proposal.

*THE LORD BISHOP OF HEREFORD said the Committee were suffering from the inconvenience of mixing up training colleges with every class of secondary school in the country. There were few training colleges, but hundreds of secondary schools distributed throughout the country. The Bishop of Winchester objected to a provision of this kind being required in the case certain training colleges; but why, even in the extreme cases to which he referred, should not students be allowed to live in their own hostels, to attend the secular instruction, and to have arrangements made for their own religious instruction? Where was the objection to it? In the right rev. Prelate's own school at Harrow and at Clifton College, over which he himself presided for fifteen or seventeen years, there were instances of exactly that character. He himself established a house for Jews, THE MARQUESS OF LONDONDERRY: and that house was now occupied by should not have risen except out twenty-four boys, who were in just the of respect for the right rev. Prelate to position in which students would be offer a few words in reply. From all under this Amendment. For a quarter I have heard I think his proposal is absoof a century such boys had been mem- lutely impracticable and impossible. He bers of that school; no difficulty had has told us that at Clifton there were ever arisen, and, as a practical school- a certain number of Jews, for whom he master, he ventured to say that no the Bishop of St. Asaph asked what he provided, and the right reverend Prelate difficulty would arise. He felt convinced, however, that there would be a considerable sense of injustice in many cases if no such provision was made.

*THE LORD BISHOP OF ST. ASAPH asked whether, if a Wesleyan or other secondary school was receiving a small amount under the Technical Instruction Acts, that school was an aided school, and

VOL. CXVI. [FOURTH SERIES.]

I

would have done under similar circumI ask him whether, if he were head of a stances with another denomination. May training college, and three Mohammedans arrived, he would build a mosque for them, or how would he propose to deal with them? As I say, I think his need scarcely ask your Lordships to proposal is so utterly impossible that I support the Government.

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