H. OF R.]

Mr. NICHOLAS moved to strike out the word " said," referring to the ideal line in the treaties. He remarked, that treaties were now holding for the purpose of forming an actual line of demarcation, which might be very different from that recognised by existing treaties.

Mr. HILLHOUSE supported the clause in its present form. He remarked, that the reference to the line laid down in the treaties was of the utmost consequence to the objects of the bill. The design is to recognise, in a summary and pointed manner, the line of demarcation. This law is to serve as a directory to the people on the frontiers, and will be sent into the Indian country. This will be a simple mode of bringing into one view the stipulations of the several treaties relative to this important point.

Mr. DAYTON objected to the section on account of its connexion with the preamble to the bill, which is not in itself binding.

Mr. GREENUP said the section stood, in his opinion, perfectly well; if it is amended, it will leave the business in such a state of uncertainty as will defeat all the salutary purposes of the bill.

Mr. NICHOLAS said, that his motion, so far from producing the uncertainty anticipated by the gentleman, would have the direct contrary effect. This motion went to enlarge, not to narrow the provision for guarding against the violation of the line so much dreaded.

Mr. GALLATIN and Mr. VENABLE supported the motion for striking out.

Mr. TRACY remarked, that the only reason for striking out the word appeared to be, that other Treaties may be made which would alter the line; he saw no great force in the objection. The clause provides that the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES shall ascertain and cause the line to be marked. That is surely desirable. Should the line be afterwards altered by subsequent Treaties, the new line will then be marked under the direction of the PRESIDENT. This will then become the

[FEBRUARY, 1796.

restrictions which were imposed, and it would be attended with the most pernicious consequences to give the occasion to find fault with the Government in this respect.

Mr. MILLEDGE's motion was not agreed to.

The Committee made various amendments in the course of the discussion. Without finishing, they rose and reported progress. Adjourned.

WEDNESDAY, February 3.

LEMUEL BENTON, from South Carolina, appeared, was qualified, and took his seat.

Mr. W. SMITH reported a bill further extending the time of receiving on Loan the Domestic Debt of the United States. It is proposed by this bill to extend the time to the 31st day of December next. Twice read and committed.

DISCOVERY OF THE LONGITUDE.

A report on the petition of Frederick Guyer was read. This petition was for pecuniary aid from Government to enable him to prosecute his researches for the discovery of the longitude by lunar observations. The report is against the prayer of the petition-the compliance therewith being considered by the Committee as unconstitutional.

Mr. PAGE moved that the report should be accepted. He observed that the principle contained in it, if adopted by the House, would, in future, save Congress from similar applications.

Mr. SEDGWICK said, if the object of the gentleman was to have the report placed on the Journal, and to be considered as establishing a principle, he should have his doubts as to its propriety. He should be sorry to have it established as a principle, that this Government cannot Constitutionally extend its fostering aid to the useful arts and discoveries; he did not think that it was true that the Government had not such a power; he, however, was not prepared at present to go into the

most propriety in referring to such line in the most plain and positive terms.

Mr. FINDLEY thought

thought the reference in the clause to the preamble might be of use, and could certainly do no injury. He was against the amend

ment.

The motion for striking out was negatived. Some amendments took place in the second section on motion of Mr. HILLHOUSE.

Mr. MILLEDGE moved to amend the clause which prohibits the citizens of the United States from crossing the line for the purpose of hunting and destroying the game. He said if this provision is restrained, it will be necessary to remove all the citizens on the frontiers at least twenty miles within the line.

Mr. HILLHOUSE recited the clause of an Indian Treaty, in which the United States had expressly stipulated with the Indians, that their citizens should be restrained in this particular point. He said this very circumstance is the occasion of the greatest difficulty with respect to the Indians; they were fully sensible of it, and well understood the

jection to agree to the report on the principle which had been mentioned: That it did not appear that the object was probably attainable by the plan of the petitioner. The petitioner had leave to withdraw his petition.

INTERCOURSE WITH THE INDIANS.

The order of the day, on the bill to regulate trade and intercourse with the Indian tribes, and to preserve peace on the frontiers, was called up.

Mr. GALLATIN moved, if it was in order [the SPEAKER said it was,] that the Committee of the Whole should be disc..arged from any further proceedings on the bill, and that it be recommitted to the select committee. He grounded his motion on a motion of amendment brought forward yesterday, founded on the Message from the PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES, and on a report of the Attorney General, which, though it had not been formally communicated, had been shown to a particular gentleman of the House. It was understood that the amendment referred to respected the line of demarcation.

FEBRUARY, 1796.]

[H. OF R.

the bill to the select committee; no amendment had been proposed which he did not suppose could

be made in the Committee of the Whole.

Mr. HARPER, who seconded the motion of commitment, said he saw no impropriety in sending the bill back to the select committee-much light had been thrown on the subject in the course of the discussion, and it was the duty of the House to avail itself of this light. Due deliberation on this important bill was certainly highly necessary, and if further information should arise in a subsequent stage of the business, he should be in favor of a new recommitment.

Mr. GILES was in favor of the recommitment, and if that motion should fail, he should then move for a postponement. The Treaty referred to in the bill has never been officially before the House. He referred to General Wayne's Treaty. Mr. SEDGWICK saw no purpose that could be answered in a recommitment. It is not pretended that there is any information to be received which is not already in possession of the House. After recommitting, in the present state of the subject, the select committee will bring in the same report which is already before us.

The SPEAKER here informed the House that the Treaty had been printed, and laid on the desk of every member; but had not been formally laid before the House. This was exactly the state of the matter.

Mr. HILLHOUSE said, that the motion to recommit in this stage of the business was not agreeable to the practice of the House, and conveyed an oblique censure on the select committee.

Mr. DEARBORN said, he did not suppose the committee had neglected to avail itself of all the

information within its reach; but as there had been a great variety of opinions expressed in the Committee of the Whole, for the sake of greater unanimity, he should wish to have the bill recommitted, and that an addition of two members be made to the committee.

Mr. SWANWICK supported the motion on the ground that the bill was predicated on a Treaty which was not before the House.

Mr. GALLATIN asked if it would be in order to offer a motion grounded on a public document (referring to the Treaty) which is not before the House. The SPEAKER said it would not be in order.

t;

Mr. HEATH was opposed to the recommitment; he considered it as a retrograde movement, and compared the proposition to Dr. FRANKLIN's carriage with horses before and behind; Congressional business progresses too slowly; he hoped the Committee of the Whole would be suffered to

proceed; he saw no difficulty in the way of maturing the bill in the Committee of the Whole.

The motion for recommitting was agreed to, and the committee enlarged so as to consist of a member from each State.

Mr. BLOUNT then moved the following in substance: That the above committee be instructed to inquire and report, by bill or otherwise, whether any and what relief ought to be granted to per

tory, purchased from the State of North Carolina; which lands, since they had been purchased, had been ceded by Treaty to the Indians.

This motion was agreed to.

Mr. S. SMITH observed, that the bill was predicated on the Treaty made by General Wayne with the Indians. He doubted the propriety of proceeding on a public document not in possession of the House. It had been laid before the members nobody knew how.

Mr. BOURNE said, the Constitution was silent as to the mode to be adopted respecting the promulgation of Treaties after they had become the supreme laws of the land. He supposed the printing and publishing the same, accompanied with a proclamation, was sufficient ground for the House to go upon in relation to any acts or appropriations which were rendered necessary in consequence of such Treaties.

The SPEAKER here interposed by observing, that there was no question before the House.

PERMANENT SEAT OF GOVERNMENT.

The House then went into Committee of the Whole on the report of the select committee relative to the Federal city. This report concludes with the following resolutions:

"Resolved, That the President of the United States be authorized to borrow such sums as, in his judgment, may be necessary (not exceeding the sum of five hundred thousand dollars in the whole, and not exceeding two hundred thousand dollars in any one year) for completing the buildings requisite for the accommodation of the Government of the United States, at the city of Washington; the said Loan to be secured on the

public property in the said city, and at such rate of interest as he may judge expedient, and payable at such time or times as he may judge proper, after the year one thousand eight hundred; and that the United States guarantee to the money-lenders, that in case the property so pledged shall prove inadequate, the United States will make good the deficiency.

"Resolved, That it shall be the duty of the Commissioners appointed by virtue of the act, entitled 'An act for establishing the temporary and permanent Seat of the Government of the United States,' every six months to render to the Secretary of the Treasury a particular account of the receipts and expenditures of all moneys intrusted to them; and, also, the progress and state of the business and the state of the funds in their hands; and generally an account of their administration; and that the said Secretary lay the same before Congress at the next session after the same shall

be received; and that a bill or bills be brought in ac

cordingly."

a

The Message of the PRESIDENT Oon this subjectparticular detail of the progress of the public buildings, state of the funds in the hands of the Commissioners, &c., signed Alexander White; and the act for establishing the temporary and permanent Seat of the Government of the United States, on motion by Mr. J. SMITH, were read.

Mr. J. SMITH, Chairman of the select committee, who had made the report, said, that the reading of the papers had been called for, that the Committee of the Whole might have a full view of

H. OF R.]

the whole subject before them, that they might be able more fully to judge of the propriety of the report. The committee had proposed a Loan on the principle of economy. Mr. SMITH and Mr. SWIFT called for the reading of several other papers-these were accounts of the expenses hitherto incurred, balances due to the Commissioners, &c. The first resolution was then read. Mr. SWIFT observed, that he would not propose any thing which should tend to contravene the act for establishing the permanent Seat of the Government of the United States. He was willing that that act should be carried into execution, but then he was not willing to go to any unnecessary expense to effect the object.

He stated some objections to the resolution: he did not think that a Loan was necessary for the purposes of the act. The funds in the hands of the Commissioners, he said, are sufficient to complete the public buildings in such manner as to accommodate Congress at the period pointed out. He referred to the details of the funds which had been read. Another objection he had to the first resolution, was the discretion vested in the PRESIDENT to institute a Loan at an indefinite rate of interest-another objection to the resolution, in his mind, was the guarantee of the Loan by the United States.

He was averse from the Government's being implicated in this business; he believed it was entirely unprecedented. Adverting to the idea of the lots being enhanced in price at a future day, he very much doubted the accuracy of this. He was rather of opinion that the Government would eventually be obliged to make good the whole Loan. On the whole, he thought it best for the Government to have nothing to do with the business, but to leave the management of it to the Commissioners by the aid of the funds in their hands; with economy they will be sufficient; but the more money there is granted, the less will be the economy in expending it.

Mr. MURRAY said, that the gentleman had taken the only ground which he believed could be taken to set aside the report of the committee, and that was that due economy had not been observed in the expenditures already made; he believed he would be puzzled extremely to substantiate this idea to the amount of one shilling.

Mr. M. said, that no public money to the amount of one shilling had hitherto been expended on the Federal city; nor is any public money now asked for. The object of the resolution is simply a Loan-a Loan on terms that individuals would think eligible. Adverting to the objection on account of the interest, he did not suppose with the gentleman that ten, fifteen, or twenty per centum would be necessary; he had been informed that it could be procured for eight per centum.

Taking a general view of the subject, he remarked, that all that was asked, was as little as could be expected. It is not a grant, a gift; it is simply to guarantee a loan for a public economical purpose.

Mr. GALLATIN objected to the indefiniteness of the rate of interest. He said it would militate

[FEBRUARY, 1796.

against the loans proposed by the Secretary of the Treasury. He moved that the resolution should be amended so as to express the rate of interest at six per cent.

Mr. BRENT said he hoped that the motion would not obtain. The sum of 500,000 dollars is so inconsiderable compared with the loans contemplated by the Secretary of the Treasury, amounting to six millions; that the rate of interest on Governmental loans could not be supposed to be effected by a rate of eight, ten, or twelve per cent. for the sum mentioned in the report. The security he considered so good, that the money would be immediately obtained, and the reimbursement made with ease at almost any rate of interest. He supposed the economy of the plan was so obvious, that no man who was disposed to comply with the act for establishing the permanent Seat of Government, would oppose it. Mr. B. then adverted to the objections offered by Mr. SWIFT, and entered into a general statement of the affairs of the city, to show the policy and expediency of adopting the report of the committee.

The SPEAKER here remarked, that the merits of the report were not under consideration, on which Mr. BRENT waived any further observations.

Mr. W. SMITH stated the difficulties that would result from not restricting the rate of interest. He said it was unprecedented in the practice of the Government; even in the loan for the benerolent purpose of making peace with Algiers, the rate of interest was fixed at five per cent. He adverted to the principle of the report, and said that when the permanent Seat of Government was first agitated, assurances were given that the United States would never be called upon for any pecuniary assistance. It has been said that the money is not now asked for; but only the guarantee of a loan; he observed on this, that the Government ought to make the same calculations as it would were the payment inevitable on its part, for the public faith should be pledged to make good any deficiency that may happen. Mr. S. was proceeding, when

Mr. BRENT rose and said, he would withdraw his opposition to the motion. He was willing that six per cent. should be inserted.

Mr. GILES moved that a blank should be left for the rate of interest. Mr. GALLATIN consented to vary his motion accordingly.

Mr. HARPER, adverting to the period when payment of the instalment shall commence, observed, that in the year eighteen hundred, the United States would be called upon for the sum of 1,200,000 dollars, on account of the deferred debt, &c. He moved that the term should be left blank. Mr. W. SMITH seconded this motion.

Mr. J. SMITH said, that it was not to be supposed that the United States would be called upon to pay one farthing of the loan. If the measure proposed should be adopted, the property in the Federal City will immediately rise in value; but if it fails, it will paralize the whole business. Mr. CRABB said, he hoped the report would not